[Rushtalk] Is Homosexuality an Addiction Like Alcoholism?

Stephen A. Frye s.frye at verizon.net
Fri Jul 18 15:49:44 MDT 2014


You are totally off the deep end.  You have inferred things that simply
weren't there.  Even Dennis has stated it *may* be genetic, but I don't see
you posting a word to him.  But I know why.  My implication is that We are
not sure what the causes of homosexuality are.  We believed something until
the 1970's.  BFD.  We believed a lot about a lot of things back then.  Maybe
we learned some things since then.  Maybe we were right.  Maybe we were not.
In any of those cases, I never posted a single word about my
thoughts/feelings about it, as I have claimed so often, but you have
inferred a lot. 

 

And yes, I think that Steve's conclusions about genetics are wrong.  Whether
it's homosexuality or whatever, his claim about being genetic, thus
automatically being bred out of the population are not correct.  There are
many things that are genetic and are neither bred out nor curable - with
today's technology.  You, on your own, made a quantum leap from my claim
about genetics in general to my thoughts on homosexuality.  Well, John, you
are wrong.  Plain and simple.  Wrong.

 

And I never made a single claim whatsoever about God's thoughts on
homosexuality. Once again, those claims about what I am obviously (you're
words) thinking are all yours, totally baseless, and absolutely wrong.

 

You made it up.  Plain and simple.  All of it.

 

So until you know what I really think about homosexuality, don't spread
false claims.  Period.  Stop it.  Something about "bearing false witness"
comes to mind, my Catholic friend.

 

From: rushtalk-bounces at csdco.com [mailto:rushtalk-bounces at csdco.com] On
Behalf Of John A. Quayle
Sent: Thursday, July 17, 2014 7:26 PM
To: Rushtalk Discussion List; 'Rushtalk Discussion List'
Subject: Re: [Rushtalk] Is Homosexuality an Addiction Like Alcoholism?

 

At 07:03 PM 7/17/2014, Stephen A. Frye wrote:



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John, you're off the edge. I have not posted a word about my thoughts on
homosexuality. Not one. You have made all of this up in your head.  


         Nolt at all.............




I haven't posted in favor of it, I haven't posted against it. 


         You don't need to......either you follow the word of God, or you
don't. PERIOD!




I haven't posted a word about God's approval. Disapproval, anger, whatever.
Not one word. Please cite different from this. You can't. It's not there.
Never was, and likely never will be.  You are creating, starting, and then
baiting an argument that simply doesn't exist. And as a result of my
disinterest in engaging you, you are claiming that I think and that I have
posted things that I haven't.  Again, you are making all of this up in your
mind.
 
Specific - where did I deny God is angry? Where did I question one word or
passage of Holy Scripture regarding homosexuality?


         May I quote? "The causes/reasons for homosexuality will likely
never be fully determined, and if they are, it won't matter. Politics will
out over science." 
You are implying that homosexuality is something other than some form of
mental incapacitation. It was historically held as such by the AMA until the
very early 1970s, when a few aggressive members of the homosexual community
decided to turn the topic into a political football, which it remains today
- all based on lies. You landed on Steve Laib, questioning his assessment of
genetics and DNA. Steve wrote, "You all may recall when the theory was
floated that it was genetic. Of course, that makes no sense in that it would
have bred out of the population generations ago for failure to reproduce
itself, or would be so rare as to be rarely seen." 

        Your answer was rather terse, "You may know a lot about law, but
obviously little or nothing about genetics." 

         This tells me that you think that Steve's conclusions are wholly
erroneous and that homosexuality is a naturally occurring condition. There
is no possible way that it can be. Only 2 or perhaps 3% of the population is
gay and therefore, it would've been bred of existence eons ago, were this to
be true. Secondly, there's no possible way God would condemn something that
was truly naturally-occurring. Think about it. That would be as ridiculous
as God condemning being blonde-haired or red-headed. 






Cite.  Now.


        You've changed the argument. Pretty good trick for someone refusing
to "take the bait." Case and this argument are closed. 




 
From: rushtalk-bounces at csdco.com [ mailto:rushtalk-bounces at csdco.com
<mailto:rushtalk-bounces at csdco.com> ] On Behalf Of John A. Quayle
Sent: Wednesday, July 16, 2014 9:24 PM
To: Rushtalk Discussion List; 'Rushtalk Discussion List'
Subject: Re: [Rushtalk] Is Homosexuality an Addiction Like Alcoholism?
 
At 11:14 PM 7/16/2014, Stephen A. Frye wrote:

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This is interesting:
 
I called into question Steven Laib's assessment of genetics and DNA.  Not
specifically in regard to homosexuality or anything else.  Strictly the
science of genetics and DNA analysis.  >From that, you have drawn - from
that place that the sun doesn't shine - totally erroneous conclusions about
my thinking on the issue of homosexuality.  And then you are using my
refusal to argue about it to further substantiate your own completely
baseless assumptions.

         I'm going by what's in the Bible, buddy. I don't know where your
head's at. You are in some kind of denial I've never run across before.
Romans 1:26-32 is checkmate, far as I'm concerned. You denied that God is
even angry about this kinda stuff. Why do we even have Scripture, my fellow
Catholic?


 
I wonder why you would do that.
From: rushtalk-bounces at csdco.com [ mailto:rushtalk-bounces at csdco.com] On
Behalf Of John A. Quayle
Sent: Wednesday, July 16, 2014 7:28 PM
To: Rushtalk Discussion List; 'Rushtalk Discussion List'
Subject: Re: [Rushtalk] Is Homosexuality an Addiction Like Alcoholism?
 
At 10:22 PM 7/16/2014, Stephen A. Frye wrote:

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What actions?  I haven't taken any actions at all.

         Precisely my point...........


 
Your obsessive compulsion to jump to conclusions is outweighed solely by the
complete inaccuracy of those conclusions.
 
I choose not debate this issue.  Without any real knowledge whatsoever about
my thoughts on the issue or my reason(s) for not debating, you continue to
try to bait the argument by stating derived conclusions that are totally
false and then using absolutely baseless reasoning to support them.
 
The only thing speaking loudly is my refusal to engage you, and I think that
is frustrating the hell out of you.
 
From: rushtalk-bounces at csdco.com [ mailto:rushtalk-bounces at csdco.com] On
Behalf Of John A. Quayle
Sent: Wednesday, July 16, 2014 6:22 PM
To: Rushtalk Discussion List; 'Rushtalk Discussion List'
Subject: Re: [Rushtalk] Is Homosexuality an Addiction Like Alcoholism?
 
At 08:55 PM 7/16/2014, Stephen A. Frye wrote:

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You're foaming at the mouth for an argument.  You won't get one.
 
I clearly recall your reactions when others - mostly I - have made
assumptions about you.  Do feel the same when it's you doing the assuming,
or are the rules different under those circumstances?  I guess I'm inclined
to believe the latter.
 
Give this a rest, John.  I won't bite - regardless of the bait.

         Don't need to......you actions speak (loudly) for you!


 
From: rushtalk-bounces at csdco.com [ mailto:rushtalk-bounces at csdco.com] On
Behalf Of John A. Quayle
Sent: Wednesday, July 16, 2014 5:20 PM
To: Rushtalk Discussion List; 'Rushtalk Discussion List'
Subject: Re: [Rushtalk] Is Homosexuality an Addiction Like Alcoholism?
 
At 06:53 PM 7/16/2014, Stephen A. Frye wrote:

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John,  don't draw erroneous conclusions from a complete lack of data.  I
told you, I wouldn't take the bait, and I won't take this bait.  So don't
dangle any more; I won't bite, and don't assume.  You know what that word
means.

         You've confirmed my suspicions without a word. Thank
you.............


 
From: rushtalk-bounces at csdco.com [ mailto:rushtalk-bounces at csdco.com] On
Behalf Of John A. Quayle
Sent: Wednesday, July 16, 2014 12:07 PM
To: Rushtalk Discussion List; 'Rushtalk Discussion List'
Subject: Re: [Rushtalk] Is Homosexuality an Addiction Like Alcoholism?
 
At 07:11 PM 7/15/2014, Stephen A. Frye wrote:

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I told you, I won't take that bait.  I won't have this argument.  Period.

         Because you KNOW deep down that God didn't create homsexual people.


 
From: rushtalk-bounces at csdco.com [ mailto:rushtalk-bounces at csdco.com] On
Behalf Of John A. Quayle
Sent: Tuesday, July 15, 2014 9:39 AM
To: Rushtalk Discussion List; 'Rushtalk Discussion List'
Subject: Re: [Rushtalk] Is Homosexuality an Addiction Like Alcoholism?
 
At 10:50 PM 7/14/2014, Stephen A. Frye wrote:

You are agreeing with what someone else is claiming, without real data.  If
there is conclusive data that homosexuality is DNA related, I don't think
it's wide spread.  On the other hand, that it's choice is even less
evidenced by data. It is extremely complex.  Recall, too, that well over 90%
of our DNA is exact to the apes and other life forms.  Human breeding
doesn't change that.  In fact, there simply are many orders of magnitude too
few DNA pairs to dictate the trillions and trillions of neural pathways in
our brain.  How all of those form is still leaps and bounds beyond our so
limited comprehension.

As for homosexuality, I won't take any bait on that argument.  Period.

         Stephen, if it's a "naturally occurring thing", then why did God
destroy Sodom and Gomorrah?  -  jaq



I work with DNA analysis all day, every day.  And my knowledge of it barely
scratches the surface.  >From what I have read here, I doubt any of us has
sufficient knowledge to scientifically debate the issue.  AS I wrote, I
can't delve into it, and I work with it every day.  I find myself doubting
you have much more knowledge that that as a law student.

The causes/reasons for homosexuality will likely never be fully determined,
and if they are, it won't matter.  Politics will out over science.  It is
incumbent on conservatives to believe it is a choice, thus allowing pointing
the finger of accusation and condemnation.  It is incumbent on liberals to
point to the other extreme in order to point the finger of accusation and
condemnation for others' lack of tolerance.  In reality, I doubt either side
truly wants to know the answer.  Each is far more comfortable in their
present beliefs and likely to disbelieve any data to the contrary - pointing
simply to the politics of any claim (much like what we see and hear today).

By the way, sickle-cell anemia and trait are not the simple result of the
combining of recessive genes, they are the result of mutant genes.

Keep studying.  It's a fascinating field.

-----Original Message-----
From: rushtalk-bounces at csdco.com [ mailto:rushtalk-bounces at csdco.com] On
Behalf Of Steven Laib
Sent: Monday, July 14, 2014 5:59 PM
To: Rushtalk Discussion List
Subject: Re: [Rushtalk] Is Homosexuality an Addiction Like Alcoholism?

If I am wrong, please explain why.  Otherwise you look as if you are making
a statement out of thin air.  

Of course, you might be referring to a recessive gene that hides between
generations, but doesn't show itself unless it is a double positive, as is
the case with sickle cell trait vs. sickle cell anemia.  But the people who
were touting this theory when I encountered it in San Fran were going with
the theory that it only required a single gene and was a dominant trait.  

So, maybe I do know something about genetics.  

SDL

Sent from my iPad


> On Jul 14, 2014, at 6:05 PM, "Stephen A. Frye" <s.frye at verizon.net> wrote:
> 
> You may know a lot about law, but obviously little or nothing about
genetics.
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: rushtalk-bounces at csdco.com [ mailto:rushtalk-bounces at csdco.com] On
Behalf Of Steven Laib
> Sent: Monday, July 14, 2014 2:17 PM
> To: Rushtalk Discussion List
> Subject: Re: [Rushtalk] Is Homosexuality an Addiction Like Alcoholism?
> 
> You all may recall when the theory was floated that it was genetic. Of
course, that makes no sense in that it would have bred out of the population
generations ago for failure to reproduce itself, or would be so rare as to
be rarely seen.  
> 
> I'm thinking that there is a likely psychological predisposition because
of events of one's youth, bad role models, or such things. 
> 
> Then, if one acts on the predisposition addiction may follow.  
> 
> As a sidelight on this, my father was an alcoholic.  I drink alcohol on
occasion, but always keep myself under control, and make sure that I never
drink too much.  If homosexuality is an addiction, it may account for the
promiscuity that pervades much of that population.  
> 
> The dysfunctions that have become so common in today's population my be
responsible for the higher number of people predisposed to this addiction.

> 
> SDL
> --------------------------------------------
> On Mon, 7/14/14, John <blueoval57 at verizon.net > wrote:
> 
> Subject: Re: [Rushtalk] Is Homosexuality an Addiction Like Alcoholism?
> To: "Rushtalk Discussion List" <rushtalk at csdco.com>
> Date: Monday, July 14, 2014, 4:10 PM
> 
> 
>> On Mon, 2014-06-16 at 05:33 -0700, Tom  Matiska wrote:>> Interesting that
Perry was comparing  his  predisposition toward alcohol to the
predisposition many  have 
> toward gay behavior.   I wonder f the light scattering of
> gasps
> from the San Fransisco audience were from the few who  actually
understood what he was saying?  Tom
> 
>  On Sun Jul 13 14:44:52 CDT 2014, Carl William  Spitzer IV  
> 
>> Addictions in all
> forms are curable and for the gay
>> community this
> is so
> much a threat that in California its
>> illegal to
> advertise treatments for homosexuality.
> 
> Guess
> what, kiddies......this means they really KNOW that  they  are committing
fraud! - jaq  >  > CWSIV>> >> > >  >
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